pets

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micker
Elementalist
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Re: pets

Post by micker »

The problem is that there are just way too many dam focus levels now. Its up to like EM 11 now?? Come on there should be a raid level focus and a group level focus, maybe two levels of each. Like back in the day when there was one focus item for pets. I don't want them tuning pets with the top focus items in mind. Pets should be great with no focus and a focus item should make them fantastic. You know that they tone down the unfocused pets, because every mage has at least some type of pet focus now. Pet focus should be a bonus not a needed item like it is now. I loved getting my EM 8 aug, but by next expansion it will be about 6+ levels below the best focus, wtf that is insane. How can they tune pets properly with EM 14 level focus out there?? If its good unfocused, it will be way way overpowered with the top focus from HoT.

Maybe they need to keep the focus level the same, but add special focuses that add procs of some kind or special pet abilities. They have to stop the focus madness.
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Voragath
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Re: pets

Post by Voragath »

They make focus pets based on the current pets. So, say, the new focused pets will be based around the 86-90 pets. And there are two tiers of focii just not in the way you'd expect. The previously raid obtainable only focii (not all ranks) become available to groupers and higher level focii become available to raiders.

Ok, reread all that. The focus only goes so low and they only make so many pet templates. A bard in my guild with a mage alt noticed today that em 6 and 7 are not focusing the 76 pets like they should. This means it's possible the new focii will only focus the 86-90 pets. That would get around the balancing issue you think they might have, unless what our bard found was actually a bug.
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Merlaina
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Re: pets

Post by Merlaina »

I think that's probably a bug. From the description on Allah of EM VI:

1: Pet Power Increase (80)
2: Limit: Max Level(90)
3: Limit: Min Level (76)

I believe the min/max levels are based on the level of the spell, not the level of the pet summoned. Thus EM VI should focus level 76 pets. However I bet there's not too many 76-79 mages with EM VI, so not a large group to notice the issue. Also I don't know if this is still an issue, but I know there was a problem with slot 3 effects stacking with already existing effects on items if they would both affect the same spell. For example if you had two EM effects on one item (one from slot 3 aug, one innate on the item such as a UF earring) it wouldn't necessarily apply the higher focus effect. Same is true if you had, say, a detrimental spell haste item with a faycite shard for a nuke. I never heard if this was fixed or not, but it could be they're inadvertently summoning the pet with a lower focus than they thought.
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Calebe
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Re: pets

Post by Calebe »

Please lets not put any pet focus item on an item all classes want as in sleeves, robes, shoes etc.. it needs to be on a non visible item (and I prefer for it to be an augment), so only those classes that use a pet focus will bid on them.

Augments are the best way, unlocked with content and then there is no bidding war and all mages can benefit from the improved pets when you unlock then as will necro's and beastlords.

I don't think bidding wars for rare pet focus's is the way to go. Make then augments as in SoD and all pet classes can reap the reward without waiting for the next pet focus to drop and hoping you get it before the expansion is over. Pets as we know are the main reason to play a mage. Unlike a necro who uses it for added DPS and beastlords who use it to enhance them, it is an integral part of playing a mage. Lets push for augments and only augments going forward, and if they don't want to go that route we have to push for it on an item, and always to be that item as in an ear, and restrict it to only pet classes, and not all/all type gear, and please make it a common drop not rare.

Calebe
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Voragath
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Re: pets

Post by Voragath »

Merlaina wrote:I think that's probably a bug. From the description on Allah of EM VI:

1: Pet Power Increase (80)
2: Limit: Max Level(90)
3: Limit: Min Level (76)

I believe the min/max levels are based on the level of the spell, not the level of the pet summoned. Thus EM VI should focus level 76 pets. However I bet there's not too many 76-79 mages with EM VI, so not a large group to notice the issue. Also I don't know if this is still an issue, but I know there was a problem with slot 3 effects stacking with already existing effects on items if they would both affect the same spell. For example if you had two EM effects on one item (one from slot 3 aug, one innate on the item such as a UF earring) it wouldn't necessarily apply the higher focus effect. Same is true if you had, say, a detrimental spell haste item with a faycite shard for a nuke. I never heard if this was fixed or not, but it could be they're inadvertently summoning the pet with a lower focus than they thought.
I tested it myself because I have EM 8 on my belt as a type 3, no other gear has a pet focus on it. I cast the 76 air pet and canni'd him. Then removed my focus, bagged it, cast the 76 air pet and canni'd him. Same % health each time.

Now, the question is, how does Lucy know what the level req is? If Lucy has a guaranteed way to know, then we need to bug the smurf out of this. My guess is it is a bug, I told our bard to bug it, and I have a similar reasoning as to why none noticed. By the time you can get these focii, you should be about level 81 anyway so most people would have the SoD pet by the time they got one. He's just trying to make his pet as powerful as possible for whatever reason--I can think of a few but the correct one is anyone's guess--and so he noticed.
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Merlaina
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Re: pets

Post by Merlaina »

But was there any innate focus effect on the item with the EM8 aug? If it's a focus effect that a pet summon spell might benefit from (beneficial mana preservation for example) then it's possible only one of those focus effects would go off, and it might not be EM8, meaning you think you're getting a focused pet but you're really not.

I find that highly unlikely in your case since that would be affecting your 81-84 pets as well, and you would notice if they weren't a white con to you. Just throwing that out there for thoroughness though.
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qibrme
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Re: pets

Post by qibrme »

Calebe wrote:Please lets not put any pet focus item on an item all classes want as in sleeves, robes, shoes etc.. it needs to be on a non visible item (and I prefer for it to be an augment), so only those classes that use a pet focus will bid on them.
Calebe
I will go one step further.
Precendece was set when all classes were allowed to by focus items from Zeb in the void by virtue of completing either group or raid progression.
It should have stayed that way in UFO.
Please BETA magicians you need to post that in the BETA forums and PUSH HARD to return to that method of awarding important things like pet focus upgrades.

My 2cp

Sued...
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Zacatac
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Re: pets

Post by Zacatac »

It's so hard to figure out what the pet focii do half the time.

For example, I have an earring with EM 5 and the aug with EM 7.

I remove the EM 5 item, and just wear the EM7, cast pet. Do the a couple different pet canni spells, record the % change.
I remove the EM7, put the EM5 on, make a new pet, do the same test, and it is exactly the same % change.
I do the test again with a different pet. Same results each time for both EM5 and EM7.
I remove both items and do the test with just base pet, and it is obviously much lower HP.

When I upgraded from EM6 aug to EM7 aug, I didn't notice a change in the pet max hits.

Conclusion - while I know these things are "working", it seems they are such low incremental values from one level to the next that I can't tell the difference when I upgrade.
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svenalo
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Re: pets

Post by svenalo »

There was a chart somewhere that showed all sorts of info from the focus items (hp, max hit, etc, etc), but you are right, you aren't really going to see much in the way of a HP gain. Using an air pet against and appropriate target, though, and you can see the max hit differ for each one.
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Voragath
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Re: pets

Post by Voragath »

Merlaina wrote:But was there any innate focus effect on the item with the EM8 aug? If it's a focus effect that a pet summon spell might benefit from (beneficial mana preservation for example) then it's possible only one of those focus effects would go off, and it might not be EM8, meaning you think you're getting a focused pet but you're really not.

I find that highly unlikely in your case since that would be affecting your 81-84 pets as well, and you would notice if they weren't a white con to you. Just throwing that out there for thoroughness though.
I tested this with the gear in my current magelo, it's the Tower belt so no innate focus there or anywhere else on me. He did the same test with the same pet using EM1 and EM2 etc. and saw all those changed con colors. While not directly an indication he did use canni and noticed that the % change was quite noticeable. He also noticed that having the focus item on your cursor is also focusing the pet so you must bag whatever you DON'T want to focus the pet. You can test this out yourself. Mem the 76 air pet and summon it with and without a focus and you'll see EM8 does nothing for the pet. Both canni's do the exact same amount.

Either they ninja-nerfed the pets or the focii are just flat out broken for those pets. There IS another explanation: the focus is indeed working but no pet templates were made for those pets with those focii.
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